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welcome HI GUYS. I AM LOOKING AT DIFFERENT SLEDS FROM ARCTIC CAT. I LIKE THE FOUR STROKE JAG. WOULD THAT BE TOO BI FOR A FIRST SLED. I AM 5FT 11IN TALL. 205 LBS. WITH LITTLE EXPIENCE RIDING. MOSTLY WILL RIDE ON GROOMED TRAILS. THANKS! TSC. Not worthy:
 

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Two Stroke Cat: The Jag is way too much motor for an inexperience rider. 120 HP in the hands of a novice is an accident waiting to happen! It rockets you to 90 MPH in a blink of an eye. Even an experience rider can very easily get in way over their head. On top of that, the big 4-stroke twin is a little crude at low speed. The on/off throttle is very abrupt particularily right at clutch engagement. Just when you are trying to load on to a trailer, maneuver around that tree or ease up over that snow bank, the Jag is at its worst. Very jerky and sudden! It is almost as nasty to control under those conditions as a full mod 2-stroke. These are exactly the situations where an inexperience rider is at their worst as well. It's a bad combo.

I rode one for a day and regardless of what I felt about it, my overall conclusion was that it was for very experienced riders only. That is certainly not the way Cat's Marketing hype is promoting it, but it's the way I saw it.

My advice to you would be to go for an F5 LXR. You will save yourself a few grand and you will find it to be a much smoother and complacent motor. It also has a very good reliability record. It has all the advantages of the new chassis and there is plenty of motor there for the inexperienced. I've been riding for over 35 years and it's good enough for me.

Just my thoughts. If I could give one overall piece of advice; get a ride on a few different machines before you buy. Anything anyone tells you is good for making you think about what you really want, but it's amasing how 10 different people can have 10 different opinions on the same subject. You will probably only agree with one of them or might come up with #11. The only thing you can count on is a huge pile of B.S. no matter who you talk to.

As far as my pile of B.S.; I thought the Jag motor was a piece of crap. Way over rated, way over priced. Designed for the "jump on the 4-stroke band wagon crowd", but a step backward in overall use in a snowmobile. At least for the type of riding I do. You may ride one and love it! I am not against 4-strokes in snowmobiles, but they have to be a step forward, not backwards!

Redd
 
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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (two stroke cat @ Apr 22 2007, 07:21 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
welcome HI GUYS. I AM LOOKING AT DIFFERENT SLEDS FROM ARCTIC CAT. I LIKE THE FOUR STROKE JAG. WOULD THAT BE TOO BI FOR A FIRST SLED. I AM 5FT 11IN TALL. 205 LBS. WITH LITTLE EXPIENCE RIDING. MOSTLY WILL RIDE ON GROOMED TRAILS. THANKS! TSC. Not worthy:[/b]

I am not sure what was wrong with the sled that redd was riding, and myself do not care for four strokes but the one I rode felt just like a two stroke until you were under 15 mph. After that the motor's brake feeling kind of makes it's appearence. Not crude by any stretch though. Not over powering and if you can ride a 600 two stroke you can handle the Jag. Very quiet, and the ride of it and any of the F series sleds is to die for.
 

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That was pretty much my point. Below 15 MPH engine braking was a real pain. It is at that speed where most of the problems can occur for a novice. Out on the open trail and above 25 MPH it was quite docile until you grabbed a handful of throttle. Sort of like a transport truck. Anyone can drive one out on the open highway, but when it comes time to make the delivery downtown, that's a different story.

Second point, was that anything comparable to a 600 class machine, is too much for the inexperienced. When you did grab that handful of throttle, it was way too much for a novice.

We have become accustomed to 120 HP being no big deal. Fact is, it is a very big deal. I would estimate it is more power then 75% of the sledders out there can safely handle or need. Like everything else, snowmobiling is all about speed and power. A release for pent up frustrations. An adrenaline rush. We would use our auto's for such a release (some do), if we thought we could get away with it. Most think all the rules disappear when they get on their sled and they turn into brainless animals. How many sledders are always going as fast as they possibly can from the moment the key is turned?

Anyway, my point was 2 stroke, that if you start out with a little less power, you might live to enjoy the sport longer.

Redd
 

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I would consider not only your experience with snowmobiles, but your riding experience in general. For instance, if you've been riding 4-stroke ATVs or dirtbikes for a few years, you'll be very used to the slight engine braking characteristics that will come from a 4 stroke, as well as the torquey hit of power that you feel when the clutch engages. In fact, if you go from a 4stroke quad to a 2 stroke sled, it will feel weird NOT having the 4 stroke characteristics.

My wife is 5'4", and weighs about 125lbs, with years of experience on ATVS, but very little on sleds. She's COMPLETELY comfortable on the Z-1 and mostly rides between 10mph and 20 mph.
 

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you guys are forgetting that the jags engine brake effect is electronicly controlled and the controller is adjustable to some extent.and a 500cc 2 stroke is nowhere near as smooth or complacent as the jag engine.my jag is velvety smooth and seamless.the guy who started this post?if you havent ridden much.....it wont matter what you buy,2 or 4 stroke,because that is what you will learn.as far as sleds go?start out with a good used sled with low miles.the used sled market is buyer friendly right now and there are lots of good ones.i would reccomend a ZL500 or ZL600.great trail sled with a pretty cushy ride.if you decide you dont want to ride you wont be stuck with a payment or high dollar sled to move.if you like sledding,then move to the bigger/new,sled.
 

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I didn't realise the electronic controller for the anti-engine braking on the Z1 was adjustable. How do you make this adjustment?

Cat has done a nice job of making the big Z1 4-stroke relatively low in vibration, but I wouldn't call it velvety smooth. When I got off of the Jag and back on my F5, it was like going from sand paper to smooth glass. It made me really appreciate my F5 and I was so glad I didn't spend the extra few grand to get the Jag. I guess if I had of blindly bought one, I would have become accustomed to it eventually (or set fire to it). All I can say to anyone looking at one, ride it back to back with a 2-stroke and decide if it's worth the extra bucks. About the only advantage it has is a little less smoke. Otherwise, it's not all it's cracked up to be in terms of sound, fuel economy and smoothness.

I wouldn't advise anyone to go back to an old Z Chassis. The F is that much better as far a ergonomics and ride. Unless you really know what to look for (and even then you can get screwed), I wouldn't advise a novice to but a used machine. Nothing can turn off a new comer to the sport faster then problems and costly repairs.

Redd
 

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Redd,if you mean to say....the 03-06 F chasiss is better than the ZR platform,i say you are wrong headed.thats why there is so much ZR in the twin spar.yes im saying the 03-06 F-cat can be smoked by a well set-up ZR.if ya won't agree....i 'll have to find you useless.
 

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My first sled was a 700 and had no problem with the power, nor would any one else that has any experience on any sorts of power equipment/heavy equipment. I have no idea what redd is complaining about (this time, its gotten to the point you cant read a topic on here with out him whining and crying) as I rode a jag for a couple hundred miles, thought it was smooth, and tame, with none of the jerkyness he states. I think it would be a fine first sled, and wouldnt think twice about putting a girlfriend, or my mother on one. An F5 is too underpowered for performance minded adults. Even if it is your first sled, you will likely be wanting more power well before the end of the first season.

Krom
 

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95ZR700: Sorry for the confusion. I didn't explain myself very well. When I referred to the F Chassis I meant the F Models with the new twin spar, as in 07's.

I have never had a ride on a FireCat, but from what I have heard and read about them, I would agree with you that the old ZR's were hard to beat in the corners and they were tough as well. They took alot of abuse. Even the new twin spar doesn't corner anywhere close to the ZR, unless there are big bumps involved, and then the twin spar starts to shine. Ergonomically, the twin spar is way ahead. That is why I would recommend a new comer getting one. Otherwise, they are going to be disappointed.
 

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Krom: I apologize for not being the big strong mocho power hungry man that you are. We can't all be so lucky.

Redd
 

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<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Krom @ Sep 4 2007, 05:26 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
My first sled was a 700 and had no problem with the power, nor would any one else that has any experience on any sorts of power equipment/heavy equipment. I have no idea what redd is complaining about (this time, its gotten to the point you cant read a topic on here with out him whining and crying) as I rode a jag for a couple hundred miles, thought it was smooth, and tame, with none of the jerkyness he states. I think it would be a fine first sled, and wouldnt think twice about putting a girlfriend, or my mother on one. An F5 is too underpowered for performance minded adults. Even if it is your first sled, you will likely be wanting more power well before the end of the first season.

Krom[/b]

Where as I agree with you about wanting more power by the end of a season, it doesn't mean the rider is ready for it. People who have not been riding for long don't have a full grasp of how a sled behaves at high speeds under different conditions and when you hop on a big machine with out that experience there is a much higher chance of a crash and or serious injury. personally I dont think any one should start on anything bigger than a 500 at least for their first season anyway. I don't mean to sound like I'm talking any one down and god knows I ride as fast as I possibly can but the equation Big sled+ noobie X slick conditions = crash, almost always holds true from what I've seen.
And if you dont mind me asking what kind of 700 were ya on?
 

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OK,OK,OK.......Here's my 2 cents worth.

4 crushed lumbar discs,
severe sciatic nerve damage,(due to failed back surgery)
2 discs partially removed,
8 Yes 8, spinal cord surgeries,
1 Spinal Cord Electronic Stimulator Permanent Implant,
1 year confined to a bed,
1 year wheelchair,
another year on fore arm crutches,
then to a cane,
Then to a 2007 JAGUAR!!!!

Do what you can with what you have!!!!!!!

The Jaguar is ABSOLUTELY the most comfortable sled ever made, believe me I have the qualifications to determine this. I can ride all day long and not get physically tired from it.
As for horsepower, all my friends were worried about me with this mill,but ride within your limits. The power is there if you need it, but the Jag is beautiful for cruising on the trails as well. The only time I open it up is on a long lake, in the daytime.

As for engine braking, you don't feel it on the Jag like you do on a Ski Doo. I rode a 4 stroke Doo in Manitoba last year, and got off after the first corner because I thought that I was going to get pushed into the trees when I let off the throttle. The anti engine braking on the Jag makes it decelerate like a 2 stroke.

If I can ride this machine, anyone can. Geeze, I should be a spokesperson for Arctic Cat!!!!!

That's my 2 cents worth. Hope it helps in your decision.
 
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