[classicdmax]

Current ride is 2014 zr8000snopro. Looking for a smoother engaging clutch than what I’m experiencing now. Seems to me to be hard engaging and don’t ever recall it being otherwise since new. I guess now it has finally gotten to me…..several years ago I put in a speedwerx stage 1 clutch kit. Didn’t particularly like it much and feel it ultimately led to issues with secondary. With the help of a few site members here I ditched the big fin and went to a team secondary. No issues since and all seems great. I did however not make any changes to primary and left the speedwerx weights and spring installed. I’m guessing weight and spring changes may help me smoothen out engagement. I’m also not opposed to a new primary if there is an aftermarket out there. I’m an aggressive trail rider looking for turn to turn. Not really looking for a performance upgrade nor am I doing any high speed lake runs. I assume any help you can offer you might be looking for spring rates and size of weights…I’ll have to report back. Just want something smooth and reliable
Thanks
J

 

[WIredneck01]

Current ride is 2014 zr8000snopro. Looking for a smoother engaging clutch than what I’m experiencing now. Seems to me to be hard engaging and don’t ever recall it being otherwise since new. I guess now it has finally gotten to me…..several years ago I put in a speedwerx stage 1 clutch kit. Didn’t particularly like it much and feel it ultimately led to issues with secondary. With the help of a few site members here I ditched the big fin and went to a team secondary. No issues since and all seems great. I did however not make any changes to primary and left the speedwerx weights and spring installed. I’m guessing weight and spring changes may help me smoothen out engagement. I’m also not opposed to a new primary if there is an aftermarket out there. I’m an aggressive trail rider looking for turn to turn. Not really looking for a performance upgrade nor am I doing any high speed lake runs. I assume any help you can offer you might be looking for spring rates and size of weights…I’ll have to report back. Just want something smooth and reliable
Thanks
J

You're clutch kit is likely the root of your hard engagement. You could go with a lighter spring.

Power Block 80 seems to be a popular smooth operating reliable clutch.

There are some billet clutches out there as well, but significantly more expensive.

 

[favoritos]

I'm curious what you exactly mean by hard engaging?
If it is just high rpms before engagement, you may just want to change out weights and or spring. It sounds like that may be the case if it has done this since the kit was installed.
Engagement is in heel weight and primary spring initial rate. A number of the aftermarket kits go with higher engagement to achieve holeshot. Some of the kits are hard to trail ride in slow stuff. It's all or nothing right off the line.
Hopefully it's that simple. I don't recall the exact parts in that kit for the Cat primary. Do you know the spring rate? Did it come with adjustable weights?
The reason that I mention the term "hopefully" is related to clutch life. How many miles are on the clutch? When they start to wear out, engagement can also be affected. Generally you would also see odd rpms in the shift as well. Those could really get out of whack on top. Those clutches liked to show wear in the rollers when they start to go. That is easy to check by using a finger to "roll" the roller. If it isn't smooth rolling, it may be time.

Sorry, I can't help much with another brand primary. I have to ask though. You went with the Team secondary? Do you mean the Boss version along with jackshaft swap? I'm asking because that would allow you to put in an ADAPT if your primary is ****ed.

 

[classicdmax]

I'm curious what you exactly mean by hard engaging?
If it is just high rpms before engagement, you may just want to change out weights and or spring. It sounds like that may be the case if it has done this since the kit was installed.
Engagement is in heel weight and primary spring initial rate. A number of the aftermarket kits go with higher engagement to achieve holeshot. Some of the kits are hard to trail ride in slow stuff. It's all or nothing right off the line.
Hopefully it's that simple. I don't recall the exact parts in that kit for the Cat primary. Do you know the spring rate? Did it come with adjustable weights?
The reason that I mention the term "hopefully" is related to clutch life. How many miles are on the clutch? When they start to wear out, engagement can also be affected. Generally you would also see odd rpms in the shift as well. Those could really get out of whack on top. Those clutches liked to show wear in the rollers when they start to go. That is easy to check by using a finger to "roll" the roller. If it isn't smooth rolling, it may be time.

Sorry, I can't help much with another brand primary. I have to ask though. You went with the Team secondary? Do you mean the Boss version along with jackshaft swap? I'm asking because that would allow you to put in an ADAPT if your primary is ****ed.

Thanks for your reply
Sled has about 6700mi
There was no jackshaft swap as it was direct bolt on. Team tied for all I can remember. Site members Greg b and joezert helped me sort out the parts and install as they recommended that install as they did the same to their sleds. Engagement is rough and abrupt. Not a smooth transition at all. Not quite sure on rpm engagement, I’d have to check that while on lift. I don’t ever watch at what rpm I’m engaging but am aware of its importance when it comes to tuning. I’ll try to gather more info on spring rates and weights tonight

 

[classicdmax]

I'm curious what you exactly mean by hard engaging?
If it is just high rpms before engagement, you may just want to change out weights and or spring. It sounds like that may be the case if it has done this since the kit was installed.
Engagement is in heel weight and primary spring initial rate. A number of the aftermarket kits go with higher engagement to achieve holeshot. Some of the kits are hard to trail ride in slow stuff. It's all or nothing right off the line.
Hopefully it's that simple. I don't recall the exact parts in that kit for the Cat primary. Do you know the spring rate? Did it come with adjustable weights?
The reason that I mention the term "hopefully" is related to clutch life. How many miles are on the clutch? When they start to wear out, engagement can also be affected. Generally you would also see odd rpms in the shift as well. Those could really get out of whack on top. Those clutches liked to show wear in the rollers when they start to go. That is easy to check by using a finger to "roll" the roller. If it isn't smooth rolling, it may be time.

Sorry, I can't help much with another brand primary. I have to ask though. You went with the Team secondary? Do you mean the Boss version along with jackshaft swap? I'm asking because that would allow you to put in an ADAPT if your primary is ****ed.

I could not identify weights, but rollers moved freely except one. I could get it to move but with a bit more effort. They did not seem to have any flat spots. I don’t not believe them to be adjustable however On the upper shoulder of weight it has a small hex set screw

stamped on spring 148-290. I went on speedwerx website but they did not offer any info on spring rate and weights for this specific kit

clutch engages at around 4500rpm

 

[favoritos]

Uff, that is pretty high engagement for normal trail riding.

Hard to know for sure if the number stamp is the spring rate. (Can't remember if Speedw puts the rate on their springs.) That rate would be higher than stock. Sounds like you may have the weights with adjustable heel? I'm not going to give much input on tuning because of the following.

Unfortunately, the roller isn't good news for long term. You might get by for awhile, but it will keep getting worse. How was the weight on that roller? They usually start showing wear spots when rollers hang. That will also get worse. Eventually, it can even "lock" the shift if they get real bad.
That's already a fair number of miles and age. You can try limping it longer, but if the weights are already wearing they go downhill pretty fast. I've had a few that were rode past their expiration time and they were super sloppy on take off and holding speeds. It's possible that you experiencing the wear symptoms along with the higher engagement of the kit.

 

[classicdmax]

Thanks again for your insight
Is this primary worth the rebuild considering its age? Alternatively what would be the preferred replacement? Power block 80 was recommended in an earlier post. I haven’t looked further to make any comparisons

 

[GregB]

Uff, that is pretty high engagement for normal trail riding.

Hard to know for sure if the number stamp is the spring rate. (Can't remember if Speedw puts the rate on their springs.) That rate would be higher than stock. Sounds like you may have the weights with adjustable heel? I'm not going to give much input on tuning because of the following.

Unfortunately, the roller isn't good news for long term. You might get by for awhile, but it will keep getting worse. How was the weight on that roller? They usually start showing wear spots when rollers hang. That will also get worse. Eventually, it can even "lock" the shift if they get real bad.
That's already a fair number of miles and age. You can try limping it longer, but if the weights are already wearing they go downhill pretty fast. I've had a few that were rode past their expiration time and they were super sloppy on take off and holding speeds. It's possible that you experiencing the wear symptoms along with the higher engagement of the kit.

That is the spring they send in the 800/600 clutch kits with the big pin clutches of that era.

 

[classicdmax]

Would the ADAPT be a suitable replacement? There’s been a lot of threads on this site but not sure I’ve seen anything pertaining to the 14’ procross?

 

[favoritos]

Rebuilding those clutches might not be worth the effort for a number of reasons.
There really isn't a quick rebuild kit. (I've used two different aftermarket versions.) You would need the tools to tear it down. It is a touchy process to push out and replace the rollers. If you get that wrong, the clutch is done. Rebuilding is an option, but there are no guarantees.

The ADAPT would fit your crank. Not sure about your secondary and belt combo working. The deflection issue will need to be addressed. Someone smarter than myself will have to chime in with belt size spec comparison for bearing primaries. Will it fit, is the main question? It is an interesting idea.

 

[classicdmax]

Rebuilding those clutches might not be worth the effort for a number of reasons.
There really isn't a quick rebuild kit. (I've used two different aftermarket versions.) You would need the tools to tear it down. It is a touchy process to push out and replace the rollers. If you get that wrong, the clutch is done. Rebuilding is an option, but there are no guarantees.

The ADAPT would fit your crank. Not sure about your secondary and belt combo working. The deflection issue will need to be addressed. Someone smarter than myself will have to chime in with belt size spec comparison for bearing primaries. Will it fit, is the main question? It is an interesting idea.

That’s what I had figured…power block 80 touts smooth and low engagement and use of oem belt. I’ll sit tight here a bit to see if any others can provide any input on the ADAPT. I have quite a few posts however concerning the clutch cover splitting over short period of seat time. There are billet cover options to rectify the issue but are adding the additional expense to the clutch. BDX is one and I believe they were around $200 for the cover.
thanks for you input
J-

 

[GregB]

That’s what I had figured…power block 80 touts smooth and low engagement and use of oem belt. I’ll sit tight here a bit to see if any others can provide any input on the ADAPT. I have quite a few posts however concerning the clutch cover splitting over short period of seat time. There are billet cover options to rectify the issue but are adding the additional expense to the clutch. BDX is one and I believe they were around $200 for the cover.
thanks for you input
J-

I had my 2014 clutch machined, balanced, clearanced, 911 kit put on. I had about 1000 bucks into back when I put the tied on my sled. Doing all that now would probably be closer to 1500

 

[GregB]

You could also try a cat yellow white spring. It’s the spring from a late 90s zr. It will lower your rpm range vs the sw spring

 

[classicdmax]

Ended up purchasing CV Tech power block 80 primary. Received today, unfortunately I’ll likely not be posting first impressions this season. My opportunity to travel north is dwindling as fast as the snow. Unboxing the unit seems stout and well built. Tuned for my machine and ready to bolt on. I just yanked the secondary for a disassembly and thorough clean down and will have all reattached to machine this weekend

 

[classicdmax]

Secondary was pulled and disassembled, cleaned and reinstalled. Although I could not separate the sheeves but all looked good. Quick start up and engagement seemed smooth and at low rpm. I run an ns1 and did not have it hooked up at the time