Arctic Chat : Arctic Cat Forum banner
81 - 100 of 102 Posts

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
453 Posts
Thanks Wyo,

Its awsome that you spent the time to do this and share with everyone!!! The stearing isssue is the one thing keeping me from giving the kid the wifes machine and the wife my machine and me getting a new MudPro Cat happy Since the primary is going off to Airdam I will have to try this at the same time.

:chug: I defanantly owe you a beer if we ever cross paths.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
453 Posts
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wyo_H1_Cat @ Aug 22 2009, 11:01 AM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
Really all there is too it. I would think one stainless steel washer would do the trick, or maybe go with steel washer that is 1/8" thick for a little more, is all you would need. If you were to use a washer that is 1/8" thick, you would take two bushings and grind exactly 1/16" off the width of each flange and install the washer at the rear of the top A-arm to replace the thickness that you ground off. This in effect moves the top A-arm 1/8" forward. Keep it tight, Do not grind off too much you don't want the A-arm to slide forwards and backwards after it's all installed.[/b]
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>
I'm not sure what the others have done using stock bushings, but the way I would go about it is to first measure the thickness of the washer(s) you're installing, Divide by 2 and carefully grind both bushings down by that amount on the side of a grinder wheel or sanding disc insuring everything is straight, at right angles and uniform thickness. You might subtract about 3-5 thousands of an inch from the measurements above to insure a good tight fit."[/b]
So I was lying awake at 0300 last night thinking of sugar plumb fairys and front end alignment and it occured to me that if you grind off both bushings you are actually only moving the A-arm half the thickness of the washer. If you grind half of the thickness off of the rear bushing it is compensating for the washer and not moving the the A-arm forward that thickness. I believe the total thickness of the washer/shim has to be taken off of the front bushing to move it the full amount.

Eh
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,673 Posts
ya no reason to cut the rear upper bushing any at all. just take slightly less than the thickness of the washer off the front one to keep it tight, each mm of shim equals about 1 degree of caster change. i recommend about 3mm.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,673 Posts
here's a pic of a bushing cut about 2.5mm to allow for a 3mm thick washer on back.

[attachment=137641:amount_c..._bushing.jpg]
 

Attachments

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
453 Posts
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE (Wyo_H1_Cat @ Oct 28 2009, 07:04 PM) <{POST_SNAPBACK}></div>
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE
So I was lying awake at 0300 last night thinking of sugar plumb fairys and front end alignment and it occured to me that if you grind off both bushings you are actually only moving the A-arm half the thickness of the washer. If you grind half of the thickness off of the rear bushing it is compensating for the washer and not moving the the A-arm forward that thickness. I believe the total thickness of the washer/shim has to be taken off of the front bushing to move it the full amount.[/b]

Not really, think you are confused with sugar plums still. Look at it this way, the distance between the tabs on the frame is a set distance apart. And the width of the A-arm with the bushings installed that fits between these tabs is about the same distance or length. Maybe a tad less for clearance. If we want to move the entire top A-arm forwards by 1/8" we need to make the distance or length from bushing to bushing of the top A-arm 1/8 inch less long in order to give clearance to install a washer on the back side.

Now it really doesn't matter if you take 1/8 inch off of only one bushing or 1/16 each of of both bushings the end result is the same, the distance or length from end of the front bushing to the end of the rear bushing is now shorter by 1/8 inch. To reduce caster the top A-arm is moved forwards. When installing, when the front bushing is up tight against the front tab on the frame and there would be a gap 1/8 wide between the rear bushing and the rear frame tab. This is where you install the washer. And in effect you have moved the entire top A-arm forwards by 1/8 inch.

The only reason I said to take 1/2 of the washer thickness off of both bushings is so you do not make the remaining flange of the front bushings too thin and thus maybe wear out sooner??? look at the pictures others provided of their installation or look at the original cut-away drawing I supplied near the top of this thread. I will make sense then.
[/b][/quote]

Look at it this way, if you took the full 1/8" off the rear bushing, it would not moved the A-arm forward at all. You would have just clearanced enough room for the shim and not had any effect on the caster.

Not saying I still don't owe you a cold one, the work you have done here is awsome!!

Thanks again!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,867 Posts
Discussion Starter · #86 ·
<div class='quotetop'>QUOTE </div>
Look at it this way, if you took the full 1/8" off the rear bushing, it would not moved the A-arm forward at all. You would have just clearanced enough room for the shim and not had any effect on the caster.[/b]
Ok me bad, me wrong, me AFU, me FUBAR and me confused myself into a corner. Sometimes I amaze myself with my own stupidity <grin> least its temporary most of the time

Geeze guys, ok you're right, guess using the bronze bushings on both my Tcat and 650 which have narrow flanges is what what clouding up my thinking. I've got enough clearance to slide the top A-arm either direction from stock a little over 3/16 inch depending upon where I install my multiple shims. Umm Beer does destroy brain cells after all.

In order to shim the a-arm forwards yes then one must remove the necessary clearance from the front bushing and install the washer in the rear.

I've deleted that post where i was being stupid and maybe it will help prevent some confusion and clean up this thread. Not sure what I was thinking.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
245 Posts
Anyone done this on a 500? I took a angle gauge that I have for woodworking purposes and checked mine. But there only appeared to be about a 2 degree difference. However I checked it on gravel which may not be all that accurate. I'm thinking about doing this because mine steers like a tank.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,673 Posts
a 2 degree diff from what? but anyways a 500 is the exact same as my 400 or the 650's, so ya it'll work.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
245 Posts
Uppon re-reading the first post I messed up the measurement.

Indiana, how much did you shim yours?
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,673 Posts
my uppers are foward 3mm and my lowers are back 2mm, but i didn't cut any on the lower there was that much front to back slop in the bushings.

i found the easiet way to measure the caster is to measure how far the front sets from the ground, then take off the front tires and raise the quad on a jack to that height. at that point if you take the tierod loose and set a angle gauge on the pad where the rod goes, with the spindle pointed straight ahead, thats a direct caster measurment. no math needed. you could also stick a magnetic angle gauge on a steel square and line it up with the balljoints, thats what i did before i found out the tierod pad was 90% to the ball joints.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
245 Posts
Ok, I did the mod last night. I shimmed mine 1.4mm. I noticed that it did turn eiasier in the driveway but didn't have much of a chance to try it. Today I went riding witha friend. I must say on the trail there wasn't much difference, but it masw mostly riding 15-20MPH or higher. After I got home I tried it around the yard and it is incredible the difference. What I used to really hve to put my weight into was easy! I had pulled around a fertillizer spreader and aerator around the yard a couple weeks ago and it was a fight to make tight turns. Now it's a breaze!!!!

I definatly recomend this. I didn't notice anything instabilty at speed. One reccomendation for any one thinking about doing this: It does not take long to grind off the ruber bushing. Don't leave it on the grinder for more than a second or two at a time. this took me less than an hour.

Thanks to Wyo for figgureing this out!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
14 Posts
This deal is great!!! I put 2 washers on each side and it is a completely different bike. Who would have thought that $1.60 worth of washers and 1.5 hours worth of time would have changed it that much.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
552 Posts
i final did this mod last week. i got machine bushings from fastenal to use instead of washers. they give me a finer adjustment. each measure .04" which is a hair bigger than 1/32". with 3 on each side the lil tank is a different beast. last sunday she did real good on the ice. but next sunday will be the big test of how she will handle in an offroad race. thank you wyo cat for all your hard work in engineering this mod.

i have several machine bushings left over if any body would want some send a pm
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
551 Posts
I did this last week. AWESOME! I can't wait until I have dry ground to try it on instead of just snow and ice.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
332 Posts
I just did this to mine, so far I just used it around the farm to get wood and check the cows but its great. I can,t belive how easy it steers now. It will be fun to see how it is out on the trail in the spring.
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
1,553 Posts
After almost a year not being able to ride got a chance to take it out last Saturday.

What a difference in the steeing!!!
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
552 Posts
sunday at the atv challenge i meet a AC lurker, don, his wife has a 700 mudpro completely stock. i let him try out the lil tank. when he came back from a short ride his eyes were as big as silver dollars. i showed him what and how the caster mod works. then i let his wife take out the lil tank. she returned and told him that he will be fixing her kitty to steer like this one NOW! wyo all your hard work is still is getting surprising comments, thanks. i think don will be a member here soon
 

·
Premium Member
Joined
·
903 Posts
Ijust did this tonight and took it for a spin in the pasture and wow. Its in 4x4 until the wife lets go of the money for an actuatore and switch but its goo for now. May have to take a washer out when I get it fixed. Even put the grease zerks in the front.
 
81 - 100 of 102 Posts
Top