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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I have a 2014 TZ1 LXR Arctic Cat, and upgraded the stock shocks in the 144" rear skid. The front stock shocks on the LXR are Fox Zero Pro, but the rear are essentially junk. I replaced both rear shocks using Fox Zero Pro replacements. One was made custom length for the rear, as there are none made to fit the TZ1. I installed the new replacement, and it seemed very stiff. I could stand on the rear bumper with very little compression. When I would pump my weight up and down, there was full range of motion, but just way too tight. The front spring set just tight enough to compress the spring, and keep it from rattling. All the components properly reinstalled and torqued to specification. I contacted the shock expert that provided the replacement regarding the issue. He suggested I ride it for a season, and if I decided it was too tight he would revalve the shock. I put around a thousand miles on the machine last season, and decided to send it back to be revalved. I think it helped a little, but still almost no sag when I sit on the sled. I have considered replacing the torsion springs (I have the blocks on the softest setting), Okay so there are two holes on the idler arm (part number 9) that the front of the shock links (part number 28) connect too. You can see in the provided illustration that it shows the upper hole being used. I decided to try the lower hole but am unsure what imapct it had, or will have on the suspension. I suspect someone will be able to provide some insight on what looks like an adjustment. I am not sure what else to try here. Any suggestions would be great. Thanks!
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There are a lot of variables with the rear skid. It's tough to nail down how changes affect ride with multiple adjustments at the same time.

Shock valving should affect how fast or how much the shock moves. The springs would directly affect sag. I believe those are 21# springs. That can be a bit much for a single rider. Do a test with the torsion blocks completely removed to see if you gain sag.
Arm location affects the leverage it will have on travel. I'm not sure how far back the rear arm mount is compared to the standard skids? That would be a factor in spring choice.

To your question about the two holes on the idler arm.
Moving to the lower hole will increase leverage of the shock link by moving away from the pivot point. The test location will make it want to move/twist the idler arm easier. That change will be tied into the geometry of spring torsion and the shock's resistance to travel. Change one item and do a floor test. The resistance of the other components will be changed against different leverage. I would verify the resistance to bottoming.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
There are a lot of variables with the rear skid. It's tough to nail down how changes affect ride with multiple adjustments at the same time.

Shock valving should affect how fast or how much the shock moves. The springs would directly affect sag. I believe those are 21# springs. That can be a bit much for a single rider. Do a test with the torsion blocks completely removed to see if you gain sag.
Arm location affects the leverage it will have on travel. I'm not sure how far back the rear arm mount is compared to the standard skids? That would be a factor in spring choice.

To your question about the two holes on the idler arm.
Moving to the lower hole will increase leverage of the shock link by moving away from the pivot point. The test location will make it want to move/twist the idler arm easier. That change will be tied into the geometry of spring torsion and the shock's resistance to travel. Change one item and do a floor test. The resistance of the other components will be changed against different leverage. I would verify the resistance to bottoming.
[/QUOTE
There are a lot of variables with the rear skid. It's tough to nail down how changes affect ride with multiple adjustments at the same time.

Shock valving should affect how fast or how much the shock moves. The springs would directly affect sag. I believe those are 21# springs. That can be a bit much for a single rider. Do a test with the torsion blocks completely removed to see if you gain sag.
Arm location affects the leverage it will have on travel. I'm not sure how far back the rear arm mount is compared to the standard skids? That would be a factor in spring choice.

To your question about the two holes on the idler arm.
Moving to the lower hole will increase leverage of the shock link by moving away from the pivot point. The test location will make it want to move/twist the idler arm easier. That change will be tied into the geometry of spring torsion and the shock's resistance to travel. Change one item and do a floor test. The resistance of the other components will be changed against different leverage. I would verify the resistance to bottoming.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thank you very much for the detail oriented reply. I ride this machine solo almost exclusively, and I weight only about 160lbs. I also typically sit all the way forward crowding the tank. I found a company out east (hygearsuspension) that offers a softer torsion spring set for a couple hundred bucks. I am already far deeper then that with the shock upgrades. It makes sense to try your suggestion by removing the blocks. At this point I think the torsion springs are the likely culprit. I was elated after I initially installed the revalved shock. I climbed on the rear bumper, and it was so soft...then I remembered I still had the steerable ski dollies under the front skis. With the weight dramatically trasnfered to the skid, it felt good, with reasonable sag. I decided to put more spring pressure on the front shocks to try and transfer some of the weight back to the skid. I also slightly tightened the front skid shock spring a little. The rear of the skid was so tight before the revalve, it felt like the front of the skid would bottom out on big dips in the trail. I really don't think the revalve helped much. I asked the shock expert about the potential idler arm adjustment, and he suggested leaving it in the stock configuration. I already had moved it just to try it. I think if anything it had a negative impact. Thanks again for your input.
 

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I'm close in weight and have spent a little time on that chassis with the same riding style. They can ride fairly well.

Try doing some flat ground shop testing before you go nuts on parts. I find it easiest to start with light settings on the suspension and adjust from that point. I really can't stress the light settings enough. Back off spring pressure until the sled starts to move. The sleds have a lot of suspension, but it doesn't get used if it doesn't move. Flat ground testing doesn't cost a dime and you can find where the suspension works.

With the sled flat on the floor, start rocking every direction from your normal riding position on the sled. It will help narrow down what isn't moving like you prefer. Too much movement and add a little pressure on that corner/section of the suspension. Get it balanced and then start testing with blocks under each section one at a time. Do the same rocking with a couple 2X4 blocks raising one section at a time. You may find some surprises. Watch your front skid arm movement when you put blocks under the rear of the skid. Usually, the coupling effect does more to the front skid arm than riders realize. Light riders will notice it more because their weight can't easily compress through the coupled skid. It is possible that you may not have been bottoming the front arm. You can further test the coupling effect on the front arm by trying without the coupler blocks.

Again, the flat ground testing is free. It's also a fun way to see how all the suspension components work together. It can also provide plenty of entertainment to family and friends when you are hopping and rocking the sled in the heat of summer. :giggle:
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
I'm close in weight and have spent a little time on that chassis with the same riding style. They can ride fairly well.

Try doing some flat ground shop testing before you go nuts on parts. I find it easiest to start with light settings on the suspension and adjust from that point. I really can't stress the light settings enough. Back off spring pressure until the sled starts to move. The sleds have a lot of suspension, but it doesn't get used if it doesn't move. Flat ground testing doesn't cost a dime and you can find where the suspension works.

With the sled flat on the floor, start rocking every direction from your normal riding position on the sled. It will help narrow down what isn't moving like you prefer. Too much movement and add a little pressure on that corner/section of the suspension. Get it balanced and then start testing with blocks under each section one at a time. Do the same rocking with a couple 2X4 blocks raising one section at a time. You may find some surprises. Watch your front skid arm movement when you put blocks under the rear of the skid. Usually, the coupling effect does more to the front skid arm than riders realize. Light riders will notice it more because their weight can't easily compress through the coupled skid. It is possible that you may not have been bottoming the front arm. You can further test the coupling effect on the front arm by trying without the coupler blocks.

Again, the flat ground testing is free. It's also a fun way to see how all the suspension components work together. It can also provide plenty of entertainment to family and friends when you are hopping and rocking the sled in the heat of summer. :giggle:
Thanks again for all of your excellent suggestions. I did some research on the torsion springs. The F8 EXT Twin Spar also utilizes a 144" track. I found a break down, and there are multiple springs available in varied stiffness. They have the exact dimensions I need. The stock TZ1 uses .405 square style wire spring. The lightest AC F8 EXT spring available that will fit has .375 wire, and I found a used set for $20.00 each with reasonable shipping. I went out and stood on the rear bumper after work, and unless I pump my weight up and down it supports me with essentially no sag at all. I decided to pull the trigger on the springs and expect substantial improvement. I can always ad more block, and the TZ1 has overload springs, that can easily be engaged, if I ever really need the extra support. I will update the results after making some tweeks!
 

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That is a nice find.
I have gone through the spring shopping deal with a couple sleds. There are so many options. . .
Looking forward to see how they change the initial setup.
 
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