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2021 ZR 8000 Ltd, ATAC, Storm 150
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I am well past break in now and I am experiencing a stumble-bog between 4300 RPM and 5100 RPM -ish. I just spoke with dealer who reports Cat is aware of it on the 2021 and are working on a flash to get more fuel to it in that RPM range? For now try to stay out of that RPM range. Anyone else having this? Anyone have any other insight?
 

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I am well past break in now and I am experiencing a stumble-bog between 4300 RPM and 5100 RPM -ish. I just spoke with dealer who reports Cat is aware of it on the 2021 and are working on a flash to get more fuel to it in that RPM range? For now try to stay out of that RPM range. Anyone else having this? Anyone have any other insight?
It's not just the 21's. There's an aftermarket tune that gets rid of it.

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thx JLR82, Is it the Precision flash I hear about? If something other care to share? Any intel if it actually fixed the issue?
 

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Yes the precision flash. No personal experience as it doesn't bother me enough to go out and do it but from what I've read it works.

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I have about 1,700 miles on mine. That rpm range has something goofy. I swear the pinging/knocking/detonation sounds like it is on it's last leg. It doesn't really feel like a stumble-bog, but it's not running right. I don't ride those rpms often and I'm basically clutched out of that range. Ironically, the EGTs don't seem to show lean in that range. (It's probably not working hard enough.) My EGTs have shown lean at higher (5800-7200rpm) range. It does concern me a bit. The thing hangs an unbelievable high idle (3800-4100 at times) after running with high EGTs. It's hard on brakes, belts, clutches, and is getting worse for some reason. I've been burping it down to fix the problem. Sadly, it gives up power with high EGT condtions.
 
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2020 Riot 8000. 2017 XF 6000 2016 Wildcat X SE
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3200 miles on my '20 Riot 8000 and its had a very reliable stumble since day one. The stumble shines in the tighter trails. Key is to keep it above 6000 RPM. Reached out to Cat last season. Heard back from them three weeks later stating no known mapping issues and to bring it to the dealer. The dealer reached out to Cat and was told there are no known mapping issues. The extended warranty has kept me from purchasing the Precision tune. It would be great if Cat released a fix for the '20 and '21's.
 

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3200 miles on my '20 Riot 8000 and its had a very reliable stumble since day one. The stumble shines in the tighter trails. Key is to keep it above 6000 RPM. Reached out to Cat last season. Heard back from them three weeks later stating no known mapping issues and to bring it to the dealer. The dealer reached out to Cat and was told there are no known mapping issues. The extended warranty has kept me from purchasing the Precision tune. It would be great if Cat released a fix for the '20 and '21's.
The real question should be why there are only a select number of sleds having this issue while most are super crisp. If it were me I would have them bench test the injectors at the minimum. Something is amiss and it should be brought out and fixed.
 

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The real question should be why there are only a select number of sleds having this issue while most are super crisp. If it were me I would have them bench test the injectors at the minimum. Something is amiss and it should be brought out and fixed.
I haven't read one 800 owner say it doesn't.

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I haven't read one 800 owner say it doesn't.

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I have read of tons and have seen first hand as well from riding my dealers Demo sled. That sled was crisp from idle all the way up to full shift.
 

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It's a mapping issue, that's why the precision flash fixes it. If it were injectors the map wouldn't fix it.

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It's a mapping issue, that's why the precision flash fixes it. If it were injectors the map wouldn't fix it.

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The precision flash has been shown to not be the end all of fixes. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. They know they have some bad injectors out there but when you are dealing with other companies parts and with this Covid thing messing with alot of manufacturers, it can slow up timely fixes.
 

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The precision flash has been shown to not be the end all of fixes. Sometimes it works, sometimes not. They know they have some bad injectors out there but when you are dealing with other companies parts and with this Covid thing messing with alot of manufacturers, it can slow up timely fixes.
It's been a problem since before cvd.

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Happened on the 23rd of January. Cruising at 50mph and it just died. Coasted to a stop. Engine would not turn over with pull or ES. Towed about 10 miles. Waited for an hour for my friends to come back with the trailer. Hand strapped it on to my trailer, that took about an hour. Dropped it off at the dealer. PTO side cylinder and piston totaled. Cat came back and said they are having a rash of faulty injectors. Dealer replaced everything on the PTO side but Cat refused to change out the MAG side injector, which seams very stupid. Rode the sled 3 hours before this happened. There were not any signs. No hesitation. No bogging. No nothing. Just coasted to a stop. Got it back this past Friday. I have put 70 miles on it since I got it back. No issues so far and God willing it stays that way. Been riding cat for 40 years and I'm not gonna change now. Needless to say I was extremely shocked and disappointed when it happened. It is only my second new sled from Cat, my first being an '88 ElTigre' 6000. My dealer was pretty quick on the turn around and I really appreciate that. Many comments on my Youtube video of others with the same issue.

He got his sled back and it is running GREAT he said.
 

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2020 Riot 8000. 2017 XF 6000 2016 Wildcat X SE
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He got his sled back and it is running GREAT he said.

There are two separate issue's happening. One is the ECU mapping and the other is bad injectors. '20's did have some faulty injector issues but its sounding like Textron went cost cutting and used full bore knock off brand injectors for the '21's. Livingston's Arctic Cat is asking their '21 800 customers to contact them for some temp fix until Cat comes up with a permanent solution. I spoke with my dealer a couple days ago and he said the '21 injector issue is much worse this year.
 

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2021 ZR 8000 Ltd, ATAC, Storm 150
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
It seems to run smoothly below, and above (4300 to 5100 ish). If rolling along at just above 5100 and mash it, it's crisp and a beast. No stumble just rips. It's mainly noticed when riding with a larger group and speeds slow down and I end up in that zone. My fear is this is a sign of something bigger? It's a shame to have to purchase a flash on a brand new sled to get it to run right. If Cat was working on a flash why wouldn't they just tell us along with a projected time-line?
 

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Not sure if I would call it an injector issue in my case. Probably should have stated the whole story, but I also have a 20 with about 4,200 miles. That sled acts exactly like @digcat describes. It has been the same since the beginning. Ran that sled right beside the 18 and 19 sleds and we originally thought it was a ticking time bomb. Used to joke that it sounded like the motor was trying to swap pistons. It is still running strong.
Just got used to that strange rpm range on the 20. That is also part of the reason I clutched the 21 out of that range. The weird running is super noticeable and annoying if you are slow cruising through towns etc. The stumble-bog is hardly noticeable if you hammer in and out of the throttle all day.

I honestly didn't think much about the issue on the 20 other than the cruising annoyance. I was under the impression that it was mapped lean in those RPMs for the regulation testing.
The process for testing is super complicated and I won't pretend to know the details. The regulations talk about testing specific speed intervals(rpms) through a range starting at 95% of idle. The calculations for top rpms are really confusing with a reference to check point speed being a point past max power when power is down to 50%.(I don't think these engines could run at those rpms.) Basically, the mapping is tested at intervals through the operating rpm range. :unsure: I'm not sure what exactly is used for the range.
 

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If Cat was working on a flash why wouldn't they just tell us along with a projected time-line?
They're not. It's epa bs, that's why the aftermarket can fix it. Mr.6000 believes AC can do no wrong, hence all the excuses constantly.

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