[adamkari]

Raced a xps 800 E tec that had some clutch work, gearing and a different air box. I took him off the line, he came back and beat me mid rang pretty bad, top end was pretty much the same, but he went by me so fast mid range that no matter what i could not catch him across a long lake. Need some clutching ideas and other performance tips. I dont like loosing.

 

[forevergreen]

Racing a sled that has been worked on and tweaked in with a stock sled is never a good idea. lol Do a little work on yours and show that canary who's boss.

Open up the spring cups in the spider and cover plate of the primary and/or put in heavier weights. It seems like 76 or 77 grams are working for guys. Also if it's got the spacer in the secondary, loose it or atleast shave some off of it.

 

[adamkari]

I was also thinking of a y pipe and reeds. Has anyone played with the gearing at all?

 

[forevergreen]

Thinking of going up or down? I dunno Seems like it has plenty of gear, you just have to get the clutching to work like it should. Seems to have plenty of power to pull the gear, so I'm not sure gearing down would help much either unless you are running short distances or are usually off trail in deeper snow. my2cents

There are some guys on here playing with reeds and/or y pipes with mixed results. Personally I don't think they are worth the money, but I have no experience with them on this engine. There are some hp gains to be had, but most end up running a programmer to make it work right so you're shelling out a lot of money for a little hp increase. IMO if you're going to do all that you might as well get a whole pipe system, but again the $/hp gain doesn't hardly seem worth. Good luck

 

[orangeprocross800]

I had a y pipe, vforce reeds and a boondocker on mine. Needed the boondocker. After clutching the sled was an animal. I have everything but the clutch kit for sale. Pm me if you are interested. I sold my sled buying a 2014. Have the carb boots that were modified for reeds too.

 

[alfie623]

I'd start with just clutching the sled. If you can get a clear picture of what RPM range your engine is running in at WOT you can tune the drive train to maximize the engine's peak output. I was able to shave about 200 RPM's off of my sled's WOT RPM range by going to 77 gram weights and changing the primary spring, I've read others are doing it but machining the primary backing plate.

I also have a Y-pipe, reed valves and air box mods and my sled is freaking animal. I wish that I could have experienced the sled with just the clutch work but that didn't happen.

The only barometer that I have is that I ride with a guy who's on a 2010 600 eTec and in stock form I would get about 5 lengths ahead of him from a rolling start but from there on he could hang with me. After the mods he claims that I just continue to walk away down the lake, he just continues to loose ground.

 

[adamkari]

What kind of clutch kits are you guys using? are you leaving the secondary stock? what kind of mods do you have to make to the boots to fit the reed valves? and i cant find anything about the air box mods?

alfie623 did you need a fuel controler too?

 

[BL'sF7]

I agree with the boys on clutching... I had my primary cups machined and put in a dalton shim.. I shaved the secondary bushing but i've decided to throw that bushing in the garbage. I bumped up to 75.5 gram weights but I'm still at 8300 rpms.. Putting 77s in today. I'm gona make them from my stock 73.5s. A little bit of mig welding and some grinding..:beer_cheers:

 

[adamkari]

why did you have your primary cups machined and what is a dalton shim? can you just add weights? 77 seems to be what most people are running. what does the shim in the secondary do? seems like everyone is getting rid of it

 

[forevergreen]

why did you have your primary cups machined and what is a dalton shim? can you just add weights? 77 seems to be what most people are running. what does the shim in the secondary do? seems like everyone is getting rid of it

You machine out the spring cups b/c they are too small in diameter and the spring is binding as it compresses and causes the primary to hang up and not move smoothly.

The shim moves the rollers in the spider away from the weights and "untucks" the weights, meaning the weights start to swing out before they contact the rollers. This gives a mechanical advantage and allows the clutch to really grab the belt when it engages.

You can just change to heavier weights or you can go with adjustables so you can play around with the mass without having to buy multiple sets of standard weights. You can also add mass to different parts of the weight, heel/tip with the adjustables. If you know what weight you want, the std weights are cheaper.

The spacer in the secondary limits the amount the secondary can open/limits the shift. It is supposed to keep the belt from being pulled down into the helix and breaking the bolts. Getting rid of the spacer allows the clutch to shift out more and gives more top end.

 

[adamkari]

do you or should you machine them out if your running stock spring? Where do you get the primary shim from? where does the shim go? On the secondary where is the shim i need to through away? and does it cause any damage to the helix at all?

Thanks for your help guys, im going to buy speedworks 77 gram weights, add the shim to the primary if i can find one, remove the shim in the secondary add a speedworks y pipe and should i go v force reeds? and where do i get the mods for the airbox?

 

[forevergreen]

do you or should you machine them out if your running stock spring? Where do you get the primary shim from? where does the shim go? On the secondary where is the shim i need to through away? and does it cause any damage to the helix at all?

Thanks for your help guys, im going to buy speedworks 77 gram weights, add the shim to the primary if i can find one, remove the shim in the secondary add a speedworks y pipe and should i go v force reeds? and where do i get the mods for the airbox?

Yes the stock spring is binding in the primary b/c there isn't enough clearance in the cups when the spring is compressed. I'm not sure how much weight you need in the primary once you open the cups up b/c we have no f'n snow. The heavier weights help cram the spring into the cups more and basically accomplish the same thing as opening the cups up, but it is harder on the spring and not as efficient. Before I opened up my cups it was running 8450 rpm and would only pull 91. After the mod it is running 8180 and 106 mph. I bought some adjustable weights to try to get the rpm down another 100 rpm or so, but I haven't tried it out yet.

You can get the spider shims from just about anybody that has weights and clutch kits. I think most are shimming .060". Installing the shim is a PITA b/c you have to remove the big nut and the spider. It has some super grade loctite and requires a lot of heat and a big cheater bar as well as some clutch tools. Also, depending on who you talk to, rebalancing the clutch is a good idea after shimming the spider b/c the spider is in a different position and changes the balance of the clutch. If I decide to do mine I will send the clutch out somewhere to get it shimmed and balanced.

The spacer in the secondary is a white "nylon" spacer. It rides on the clutch shaft and "inside" the spring. You can easily see it if you look through the ramps of the helix where the rollers ride. There is a pic of it in one of the other threads on here, but you'll know it when you see it. Also you might not have one in there depending on the year/build date of your sled. The 12s and early 13s didn't have it and were supposed to have it put in with an update kit. The late build 13s came with it. Cat thinks the belt gets sucked too far into the secondary and is putting pressure on the helix and helix bolts without the spacer, but the spacer really limits the shift of the secondary and therefore takes away some top end.

 

[alfie623]

What kind of clutch kits are you guys using? are you leaving the secondary stock? what kind of mods do you have to make to the boots to fit the reed valves? and i cant find anything about the air box mods?

alfie623 did you need a fuel controler too?

My sled has Arctic Cat weights and spring (yellow/white). The air box modification has an Arctic Cat part number and is in the accessory catalog. It's basically a piece of Frog Skin and some holes in the nose in front of the air box.

I'm not using a controller and initially I had an Octane warning on the first day but I haven't since and I think it was because I was riding in deep powder and the exhaust might have been restricted.

 

[zeuss]

do you or should you machine them out if your running stock spring? Where do you get the primary shim from? where does the shim go? On the secondary where is the shim i need to through away? and does it cause any damage to the helix at all?

Thanks for your help guys, im going to buy speedworks 77 gram weights, add the shim to the primary if i can find one, remove the shim in the secondary add a speedworks y pipe and should i go v force reeds? and where do i get the mods for the airbox?

Buy dalton weights. Then you can add or take away weight if needed,and a 39 /46 helix ... Air box don't need to be modifided. But put heat reflective tape on it to reduce heat in side. Ypipe and pcv as they run lean in the mid range 5500rpm to 7000 add fuel. Best of luck.

 

[zr925]

Clutch it and gears. Gears turn a sled into a monster. Try to just gear it and take it for a rip. It makes a huge difference. Then you need to hook up off the line or that doo will smoke ya

 

[zr925]

I raced a xc800 with my zr 800. When my zr was geared down a couple teeth we where pretty much neck n neck. Went back to my stock gearing and got my a$$ whooped

 

[catattack57]

I am running the Bikeman Procross Stage 2 clutch kit in my F800, along with Boyesen Rage Cages and the Bikeman Y pipe. I also am running the Power Commander V due to the reeds and y pipe. The clutch kit includes the Dalton style adjustable weights, and I can tell you that I am over 80 grams with them, still turning close to 8300 rpm, so going to add a little more. I love the torsional conversions, have not actually raced against a 800 Rev, but the sled is wicked fast compared to some of my other riding buddies sleds.

 

[adamkari]

What RPM is this sled supposed to run at? im running at 8450 and getting on avg 106 on GPS which is 111 on spedo, as long as its cold, when its warm, it must change the timming becuase its slow.

 

[alfie623]

What RPM is this sled supposed to run at? im running at 8450 and getting on avg 106 on GPS which is 111 on spedo, as long as its cold, when its warm, it must change the timming becuase its slow.

You sure that isn't cold air HP vs warm air HP?

 

[mnmsnowbeast]

why did you have your primary cups machined and what is a dalton shim? can you just add weights? 77 seems to be what most people are running. what does the shim in the secondary do? seems like everyone is getting rid of it

If you have any binding of primary bushings in either the movable sheeve or cover,have your dealer remove the spider and clerance them,and at that time add a dalton stepped shim,to untuck the weights,add a heavier set of primary weights and spring,start there first,do little steps to see what is working and what is not!!