Studs ate my idlers. (deferred maintenance costs) - ArcticChat.com - Arctic Cat Forum
Procross 2012-? General talk regarding 2012 & newer

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post #1 of 17 Old 04-08-2019, 07:43 PM Thread Starter
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Angry Studs ate my idlers. (deferred maintenance costs)

Hi, just a quick note to remind you that track studs need to be checked for tightness before they loosen to the point where damage occurs.

2015 ZR 6000, studs were installed new by the dealer. 4500km's later they have destroyed the 4 inner idlers and started to eat the tri-hub idlers. Drive sprockets are ok and there appears to be no other damage. When I went to the Woody's web site to find out what the torque spec is, there is a notice to make sure you check stud tightness regularly. DOH!

So I am replacing all 6 idlers and the tri-hub with 2019 parts. The 2019 idlers are MUCH cheaper than the 2015 items. I am also replacing all the studs, most of the aluminum nuts are worn as are the backing plates. Studs could be reused but I am sucker for punishment. Some of the nuts have gone completely round and require cutting the stud off. The only thing worse than studding a track is unstudding a track.

Lesson learned.

Greg
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post #2 of 17 Old 04-09-2019, 09:21 AM
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I'm a little surprised there is that much damage. I have found loose studs when checking. It has been pretty rare to find much damage to the idlers.


I have had to cut off bent studs over the years. Most of them, I could use a cut off wheel above the nut. You mentioned the nuts were rounded. Is that from socket slipping on the nut? Just curious to see why they are rounded.


BTW, the 2019 wheels are slightly smaller diameter. The rear axle is not going to be a direct fit as well. The openings in the rails are larger for the straight through axle on the 2019.

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post #3 of 17 Old 04-09-2019, 12:34 PM
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Red loctite on those lock nuts every time for me. I had stud boy studs loosen up with the "tall" nuts and lost about 15 studs one weekend. A couple of the studs were relocated and shoved in sideways by the idler wheels. Never again. Pulled every nut off and did red not blue loctite.



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post #4 of 17 Old 04-09-2019, 02:54 PM
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well to be honest its rather common info that ONCE studs are installed, your supposed to go back over them to make sure they stayed tight to torque spec's

so after a few rides, your SUPPOSED to go back over them to ensure there tight, as things settle from riding, and many times need to be re torqued however, very few folks ever do this I am sure and most tun the gamble and HOPE it works out OK
as they say some times you win, some times you loose LOL

SO the question here will be, did you re torque them after a few rides/miles??
as if not, your sadly in p[art to blame for the issue on hand!
not bashing just saying!
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post #5 of 17 Old 04-09-2019, 04:52 PM
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Originally Posted by tiggershark View Post
Red loctite on those lock nuts every time for me. I had stud boy studs loosen up with the "tall" nuts and lost about 15 studs one weekend. .
I never seen"tall" nuts in kits that weren't aluminum. I never use those, too easy to strip them

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post #6 of 17 Old 04-09-2019, 05:55 PM
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Again, I'm surprised.
Have not had the kind of problems you guys are describing. The issues I have seen are mainly operator related with bent studs. Of course, I have found a couple of loose studs when I checked.

Most of the tracks I've been running are at 1.25" or more with studs. I have run mainly stud boy and woody's for quite a few years. Most of them with tall aluminum nuts. They have been Nyloc nuts though. - Not sure if that is the difference?


I usually stud at least one track every season. It is a regular routine. I studded three tracks this year and they all have over 3,000 miles already. Have not had any failures except the occasional bent stud or backer on one machine. I know why those are bent.


I actually like studding tracks, but I don't do all the extra work you guys describe. I just use a good sharp bit when drilling holes. I have quit worrying about torque specs, or adding loctite, etc. I don't even use an allen wrench anymore. I just push in the stud and let the hole friction hold the stud from spinning. I tighten them down snug with a 3/8 battery impact and deep well socket. I have had very good success with this method. Rough math is over 2,400 studs in the past ten years on 17 sleds. Quite a few of those machines have had over 6,000 miles before they left. I have seen idler wear, mostly on the older machines. The newer idlers hold up very well. I have replaced one idler this season.
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post #7 of 17 Old 04-09-2019, 08:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by favoritos View Post
Again, I'm surprised.
Have not had the kind of problems you guys are describing. The issues I have seen are mainly operator related with bent studs. Of course, I have found a couple of loose studs when I checked.

Most of the tracks I've been running are at 1.25" or more with studs. I have run mainly stud boy and woody's for quite a few years. Most of them with tall aluminum nuts. They have been Nyloc nuts though. - Not sure if that is the difference?


I usually stud at least one track every season. It is a regular routine. I studded three tracks this year and they all have over 3,000 miles already. Have not had any failures except the occasional bent stud or backer on one machine. I know why those are bent.


I actually like studding tracks, but I don't do all the extra work you guys describe. I just use a good sharp bit when drilling holes. I have quit worrying about torque specs, or adding loctite, etc. I don't even use an allen wrench anymore. I just push in the stud and let the hole friction hold the stud from spinning. I tighten them down snug with a 3/8 battery impact and deep well socket. I have had very good success with this method. Rough math is over 2,400 studs in the past ten years on 17 sleds. Quite a few of those machines have had over 6,000 miles before they left. I have seen idler wear, mostly on the older machines. The newer idlers hold up very well. I have replaced one idler this season.
Agreed, I snug them down until flat face of studs head is level with track (or sunken into “quiet-ride” lugs), screw their torque specs.

If you torque them to those specs, you’re only inviting idler wheel and tri-hub wear.

Been doing that for years, never an issue with push through studs.

I do know of a few folks who use nylon backers (huge freaking mistake, IMO), as those do not ever reach a true “tight” as plastic/nylon keeps squishing as torque is applied, and doesn’t pull flange face flush with tracks inner surface.
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That is freeking sick man........
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0637-185: '99 Sno-Pro APV (guide and button) update kit p/n...
0637-186: '99 Sno-Pro APV superseded valve inserts update kit p/n...
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post #8 of 17 Old 04-09-2019, 08:47 PM
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Open this up and see how flanges all flush or below rubber surfaces.

No torque spec was used here, just my MAC BWP138-Z2 3/8” drive impact.
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Who, me?! Don't listen to me.... (I don't know anything, evidently...)

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If it's cnote approved it will work good
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Originally Posted by DonoBBD View Post
That is freeking sick man........
Don
0637-185: '99 Sno-Pro APV (guide and button) update kit p/n...
0637-186: '99 Sno-Pro APV superseded valve inserts update kit p/n...
https://www.arcticchat.com/forum/z-z...tml?highlight=

http://www.randakksblog.com/more-on-...fear-the-corn/

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post #9 of 17 Old 04-09-2019, 11:35 PM
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Why did you take that track off

Ron
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post #10 of 17 Old 04-10-2019, 03:55 AM
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It’s brand new. (I put it on a sled for a customer where I used to work for past 3+ years), has pulled his previous 2.25” Power Claw track in favor of the 1.6” Cobra and studs.

Who, me?! Don't listen to me.... (I don't know anything, evidently...)

Quote:
If it's cnote approved it will work good
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Originally Posted by DonoBBD View Post
That is freeking sick man........
Don
0637-185: '99 Sno-Pro APV (guide and button) update kit p/n...
0637-186: '99 Sno-Pro APV superseded valve inserts update kit p/n...
https://www.arcticchat.com/forum/z-z...tml?highlight=

http://www.randakksblog.com/more-on-...fear-the-corn/

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